Author Topic: Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info  (Read 5969 times)

Larry

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1464
  • Scallywags Rule
    • Chronologer of the PBW
Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info
« on: July 23, 2008, 09:35:45 pm »
Hi all,

With the topic on mobile phones discussed a lot on this forum, I thought I'd post an article in our daily rag today. It's below. The jury is still out for me but it's something to blame i suppose!!! i think it will be another 10 or 20 years before we really know the answer, you see it's similar to smoking - all the studies intiially were funded by the tobacco companies, well, likewise here, the research dollars are coming from the mobile phone companies so getting the real answer is tough.

Make your own mind up

Laz

The head of a prominent cancer research institute has issued an unprecedented warning to his faculty and staff: limit mobile phone use because of the possible risk of cancer.

The warning from Dr. Ronald B. Herberman, director of the University of Pittsburgh Cancer Institute, is contrary to numerous studies that don't find a link between increased tumors and mobile phone use, and a public lack of worry by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration.

Herberman is basing his alarm on early, unpublished data. He says it takes too long to get answers from science and he believes people should take action now - especially when it comes to children.

"Really at the heart of my concern is that we shouldn't wait for a definitive study to come out, but err on the side of being safe rather than sorry later," Herberman said.

Herberman's advice is sure to raise concern among many mobile phone users and especially parents.

In the memo he sent to about 3000 faculty and staff on Wednesday, he says children should use cell phones only for emergencies because their brains are still developing.

Adults should keep the phone away from the head and use the speakerphone or a wireless headset, he says. He even warns against using mobile phones in public places like a bus because it exposes others to the phone's electromagnetic fields.

The issue that concerns some scientists - though nowhere near a consensus - is electromagnetic radiation, especially its possible effects on children. It is not a major topic in conferences of brain specialists.

A 2008 University of Utah analysis looked at nine studies - including some Herberman cites - with thousands of brain tumor patients and concludes "we found no overall increased risk of brain tumors among cellular phone users. The potential elevated risk of brain tumors after long-term cellular phone use awaits confirmation by future studies."

Studies last year in France and Norway concluded the same thing.

"If there is a risk from these products - and at this point we do not know that there is - it is probably very small," the Food and Drug Administration says on an agency Web site.

Still, Herberman cites a "growing body of literature linking long-term mbile phone use to possible adverse health effects including cancer."

"Although the evidence is still controversial, I am convinced that there are sufficient data to warrant issuing an advisory to share some precautionary advice on cell phone use," he wrote in his memo

A driving force behind the memo was Devra Lee Davis, the director of the university's centre for environmental oncology.
"The question is do you want to play Russian roulette with your brain," she said in an interview that she did from her mobile phone. "I don't know that cell phones are dangerous. But I don't know that they are safe."
Of concern are the still unknown effects of more than a decade of cell phone use, with some studies raising alarms, said Davis, a former health adviser in the Clinton Administration.
She said 20 different groups have endorsed the advice the Pittsburgh cancer institute gave, and authorities in England, France and India have cautioned children's use of mobile phones.
Herberman and Davis point to a massive ongoing research project known as Interphone, involving scientists in 13 nations, mostly in Europe. Results already published in peer-reviewed journals from this project aren't so alarming, but Herberman is citing work not yet published.
The published research focuses on more than 5000 cases of brain tumors. The National Academy of Sciences in the U.S., which isn't participating in the Interphone project, reported in January that the brain tumor research had "selection bias." That means it relied on people with cancer to remember how often they used cell phones. It is not considered the most accurate research approach.
The largest published study, which appeared in the Journal of the National Cancer Institute in 2006, tracked 420,000 Danish mobile phone users, including thousands that had used the phones for more than 10 years. It found no increased risk of cancer among those using mobile phones.
A French study based on Interphone research and published in 2007 concluded that regular mobile phone users had "no significant increased risk" for three major types of brain tumors. It did note, however, that there was "the possibility of an increased risk among the heaviest users" for one type of brain tumor, but that needs to be verified in future research.
Earlier research also has found no connection.
Joshua E. Muscat of Penn State University, who has studied cancer and mobile phones in other research projects partly funded by the mobile phone industry, said there are at least a dozen studies that have found no cancer-cell phone link. He said a Swedish study cited by Herberman as support for his warning was biased and flawed.
"We certainly don't know of any mechanism by which radiofrequency exposure would cause a cancerous effect in cells. We just don't know this might possibly occur," Muscat said
Mobile phones emit radiofrequency energy, a type of radiation that is a form of electromagnetic radiation, according to the US National Cancer Institute. Though studies are being done to see if there is a link between it and tumors of the brain and central nervous system, there is no definitive link between the two, the institute says on its website.
"By all means, if a person feels compelled that they should take precautions in reducing the amount of electromagnetic radio waves through their bodies, by all means they should do so," said Dan Catena, a spokesman for the American Cancer Society. "But at the same time, we have to remember there's no conclusive evidence that links cell phones to cancer, whether it's brain tumors or other forms of cancer."
Joe Farren, a spokesman for the CTIA-The Wireless Association, a trade group for the wireless industry, said the group believes there is a risk of misinforming the public if science isn't used as the ultimate guide on the issue.
"When you look at the overwhelming majority of studies that have been peer reviewed and published in scientific journals around the world, you'll find no relationship between wireless usage and adverse health affects," Farren said.
Frank Barnes, who chaired a recent National Research Council report looking into what studies are needed to assess the health effects of wireless communications, said Wednesday that "the jury is out" on how hazardous long-term mobile phone use might be.
Speaking from his mobile phone, the professor of electrical and computer engineering at the University of Colorado at Boulder said he takes no special precautions with his own mobile phone. And he offered no clear advice to people worried about the matter.
It's up to each individual to decide what if anything to do. If people use a mobile phone instead of having a land line, "that may very well be reasonable for them," he said
2.0cm AN removed Nov 2002.
Dr Chang St Vincents, Sydney
Australia. Regrowth discovered
Nov 2005. Watch and wait until 2010 when I had radiotherapy. 20% shrinkage and no change since - You beauty
Chronologer of the PBW
http://www.frappr.com/laz

leapyrtwins

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10826
  • I am a success story!
Re: Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info
« Reply #1 on: July 23, 2008, 10:23:41 pm »
Laz -

thanks for the info.

I just finished reading a shorter version of what you posted on MSN.com

From what I gathered from the shorter version, the guys in Pittsburgh are trying to link cell phone use to cancerous tumors - and, as we well know, acoustic neuromas don't fall into that category.

It's an interesting article nonetheless.  IMO the debate will rage on for many more years.  I wonder in the end what the outcome will finally be  ???

Jan
Retrosig 5/31/07 Drs. Battista & Kazan (Hinsdale, Illinois)
Left AN 3.0 cm (1.5 cm @ diagnosis 6 wks prior) SSD. BAHA implant 3/4/08 (Dr. Battista) Divino 6/4/08  BP100 4/2010 BAHA 5 8/2015

I don't actually "make" trouble..just kind of attract it, fine tune it, and apply it in new and exciting ways

Jim Scott

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7241
  • 1943-2020 Please keep Jim's family in your hearts
Re: Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info
« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2008, 10:29:35 pm »
Here we go again.

Herberman is basing his alarm on early, unpublished data. He says it takes too long to get answers from science and he believes people should take action now - especially when it comes to children.

"Really at the heart of my concern is that we shouldn't wait for a definitive study to come out, but err on the side of being safe rather than sorry later," Herberman said.


The article says quite clearly that there is no correlation between cell phone use and brain tumors but this fellow doesn't like that conclusion so he is going to claim that not being 100% sure is tantamount to being at risk.  How absurd.  In science, nothing is ever 100%.  Acoustic Neuromas were discovered over 100 years ago (in cadavers used by medical schools) long, long before cell phones were invented.  This is pure hysteria with little-to-no basis in fact.  Dr. Herberman should know better.

It goes without saying that folks can follow this hysterical fellow's advice and throw away their cell phone, use a headset, whatever, if they wish, but I don't see any real evidence for his concerns.  You can find risk in almost anything if you look hard enough.  This alarmist way of thinking is dismaying to me.  We're becoming a nation of too-easily frightened people. 

Laz:

I appreciate the post and the chance to see another point of view but I heartily disagree with Dr. Herberman, who seems to base his concerns on scant evidence and a lot of 'what if?' conjecture, attained without benefit of scientific evidence, that, according to this doctor, 'takes too long'.  How ridiculous a statement is that?    This is just rubbish, in my opinion, which is mine alone and does not represent the ANA in any way.  Thanks for the chance to state my case, as it were.

Jim
4.5 cm AN diagnosed 5/06.  Retrosigmoid surgery 6/06.  Follow-up FSR completed 10/06.  Tumor shrinkage & necrosis noted on last MRI.  Life is good. 

Life is not the way it's supposed to be. It's the way it is.  The way we cope with it is what makes the difference.

Sam Rush

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 282
Re: Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info
« Reply #3 on: July 24, 2008, 09:22:11 am »
I have proof that cell phones cause acoustic neuromas!!!








Just kidding.   Sam
1 cm AN translab, Dr. Brackmann, Dr. Schwartz, Dr Doherety HEI   11/04   Baha 7/05

Jeanlea

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 799
Re: Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info
« Reply #4 on: July 24, 2008, 09:34:34 am »
Sam, that was TOO funny.   ;D  I tend to agree with Jim.  I'm waiting for real scientific verification.  I had a teacher in high school that tried to make a similar point about jumping to conclusions by saying that "95% of people in mental instituions have eaten lettuce, therefore lettuce must cause mental problems."  LOL

Jean
translab on 3.5+ cm tumor
September 6, 2005
Drs. Friedland and Meyer
Milwaukee, WI
left-side facial paralysis and numbness
TransEar for SSD

ppearl214

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7449
  • ANA Forum Policewoman - PBW Cursed Cruise Director
Re: Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info
« Reply #5 on: July 24, 2008, 09:37:22 am »
*runs over to pinch Sam's arm!*   :o   

Cute, Sam! you almost got me on that one! ;) :)


Oh, the debates, the debates on this one... noted all over this forum (you can do a "search" here for  cellphones and find the topics....)

I'm sitting this one out..... heck, I already got the "dreaded" and not from smoking (yeah, I smoke).. and not from cellphone use... and not from my diet..... and no known cause...... and I refuse to be an ostrich and live with my head in the sand and run and hide from all devices, including my microwave oven, that could be hazardous to my health. Life it too short.... I'm gonna live it.. and that includes talking on the 2 cellphones I have (one for work, one for personal).

Oy.....

Phyl
"Gentlemen, I wash my hands of this weirdness", Capt Jack Sparrow - Davy Jones Locker, "Pirates of the Carribbean - At World's End"

Tamara

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 282
Re: Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info
« Reply #6 on: July 24, 2008, 11:52:15 am »
I saw the video on this and they mentioned both brain tumors and "tumors on the acoustic nerve".  I got my cell phone in March, a month after my diagnosis.  I HAVE eaten lettuce, however....Hmm....

Tammy
7 mm AN left side
translab 6-12-08
postop issues including CSF leak, eye issues, and facial palsy.  All issues resolved at 9 mos. except slight facial palsy & weakness.  Continuing to improve...

pswift00

  • New Member
  • *
  • Posts: 39
Re: Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info
« Reply #7 on: July 24, 2008, 01:14:21 pm »
Ha. I also read an article today about how some types of granite, used in countertops, contain uranium and give off radon.  The story was about some woman who found it in her own countertops and had them removed 'immediately.'  Then they quote some sciencey guy who says you'd have to pretty much commit yourself to leaning on your countertops 24-7 to suffer any consequences you wouldn't otherwise risk by otherwise living and breathing.  I'm guessing the cell phone cancer risk is pretty much the same, just like the saccharine cancer risk, or the risk of getting cancer from eating grilled foods, or (insert cancer-causing activity here).  In other words, if you do anything to incredible excess, it's probably not going to be good for you.

leapyrtwins

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10826
  • I am a success story!
Re: Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info
« Reply #8 on: July 24, 2008, 05:48:14 pm »
Good one, Sam - and Jean  :D

Phyl, you smoke  :o  Who knew? 

I'm certain that my AN must have been caused by lettuce since I haven't been around any granite countertops lately  ;)

The things they come up with these days  ::)

Jan
Retrosig 5/31/07 Drs. Battista & Kazan (Hinsdale, Illinois)
Left AN 3.0 cm (1.5 cm @ diagnosis 6 wks prior) SSD. BAHA implant 3/4/08 (Dr. Battista) Divino 6/4/08  BP100 4/2010 BAHA 5 8/2015

I don't actually "make" trouble..just kind of attract it, fine tune it, and apply it in new and exciting ways

Larry

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1464
  • Scallywags Rule
    • Chronologer of the PBW
Re: Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info
« Reply #9 on: July 24, 2008, 06:12:15 pm »
Hi guys,

I know this topic has been done like a pig on a spit but just thought I'd liven the debate up again.

Jim, i agree that we shouldn't be making decisions on anything without a lack of evidence but you know what, gut feel counts for a bit. Not that i have woman's intuition (last time I looked anyway) but there is something in that.

I dare say that someone will have a breakthrough on AN's and discover the cause or causes  - i doubt whether in our life time (well mine anyway). Oh well, we got a laugh out of the thread so thats gotta be good.

Laz

p.s my phone's ringing, do i answer it????????????
Think I'll call ghostbusters!!!!!!
2.0cm AN removed Nov 2002.
Dr Chang St Vincents, Sydney
Australia. Regrowth discovered
Nov 2005. Watch and wait until 2010 when I had radiotherapy. 20% shrinkage and no change since - You beauty
Chronologer of the PBW
http://www.frappr.com/laz

oHIo

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 145
Re: Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info
« Reply #10 on: July 24, 2008, 09:58:13 pm »
If cell phones cause ANs and I am now using my only good ear to talk on my cell I could be in trouble.  Then again, if I develop an AN on my left side, how do I distinguish if it is from NF2 or the cell phone?  ;)

For now, I'm off to go eat some lettuce and fall asleep on my granite countertops while talking on my cell phone.  I like living life on the edge.  ;D

leapyrtwins

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10826
  • I am a success story!
Re: Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info
« Reply #11 on: July 24, 2008, 10:00:18 pm »

For now, I'm off to go eat some lettuce and fall asleep on my granite countertops while talking on my cell phone.  I like living life on the edge.  ;D

Oh, you rebel, you.  Living dangerously again, I see  ;)  :D

Jan
Retrosig 5/31/07 Drs. Battista & Kazan (Hinsdale, Illinois)
Left AN 3.0 cm (1.5 cm @ diagnosis 6 wks prior) SSD. BAHA implant 3/4/08 (Dr. Battista) Divino 6/4/08  BP100 4/2010 BAHA 5 8/2015

I don't actually "make" trouble..just kind of attract it, fine tune it, and apply it in new and exciting ways

Debbi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1921
  • Originator of the Magic Scarf
    • Debbi's AN Blog
Re: Mobile / Cell phones - more confusing info
« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2008, 07:24:28 am »
Laz - thanks for starting this thread - I've gotten more laughs in the last 2 minutes of reading this than I would usually have in the first two hours of my day! 

Ohio, you are too funny - I picture you lying recumbent on your granite countertops nibbling a lettuce leaf while talking in a desultory tone on your cell phone...  and you are no doubt talking to Tammy (hey, wait, Tammy, is that a small fleck of lettuce stuck in your tooth???)   Quick, someone call Jim....

Okay, I'll try to be more circumspect now...

Debbi :-X
Debbi - diagnosed March 4, 2008 
2.4 cm Right Side AN
Translab April 30, 2008 at NYU with Drs. Golfinos and Roland
SSD Right ear, Mild synkinesis and facial nerve damage
BAHA "installed" Feb 2011 by Dr. Cosetti @ NYU

http://debsanadventure.blogspot.com

4cm in Pacific Northwest

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1324
4cm Left, 08/22/07 R/S 11+ hr surgery Stanford U, Dr. Robert Jackler, Dr. Griffith Harsh, Canadian fellow Assist. Dr. Sumit Agrawal. SSD, 3/6 on HB facial scale, stick-on-eyeweight worked, 95% eye function@ 6 months. In neuromuscular facial retraining. Balance regained! Recent MRI -tumor receded!

JulieE

  • Guest
Re: Cell phones/other causes - my take
« Reply #14 on: July 25, 2008, 09:37:49 am »
 I think that if it were cell phones, all of our Neurologists would have AN's!  I like to theorize, and here some food for thought (BTW - what's wrong with lettuce?!):   At the risk of having my butt kicked by a plethora of engineers who I did work for and who subscribe to the Scientific Method and not pure conjecture, I believe it has to do with metal.  Not having read up on the genetics and biology of these tumors, I'm guessing there is a predisposition to produce benign tumors elsewhere, and metal is the catalyst:  I'm not sure what alloys, and where you are exposed may vary.  I remember asking my doc if it could have been the clean room and he said no connection likely.  They had, infact, had documented evedenceof ANs 150 years aog, long b4 cell phones (but during the iron age!).  In my research prior after diagnosis I came across a case of two sisters from Buffalo, NY who were diagnosed with ANs and they were (not NF2) unusual because a familial trait had not been linked before.  I spent time in Fishkill, NY so I began thinking maybe it was the Hudson with it's pollution and heavy metals.  Then reading on, I found that they had a metal (if I remember right it was copper or chrome smelting) plant near their home and I had an epiphany about how I worked in planarization of metals and handled many wafers that had just come from deposition.  I can tell you that I personally determined that my developing acrophobia coordinated to that period, which ( having gone from the higher the better, to fear) was my inner ear saying 'something is not right with your balance", so I believe it started growing at that time.  BTW, these PHDs came to me for not only my trained observation of what was happening under the scope, but also for a little intuition - in R&D that's sometimes good.  Classical training mixed with this simple sort produced invention disclosures and publications.
I saw a previous thread about Dental work, and I think it should be further investigated.  Like buying cheap products from China for our kids might unknowingly have exposed them to lead, we have to put two and two together somehow for future generations.
I'm POed at my local gov for wanting to "mandate" the new mercury containing bulbs - boon to energy savings, bad for our future ground water sourcing.  Consequences always.  For what it's worth I think we need to learn from the Romans.
Jules