ANA Discussion Forum
Useful Information => Physicians => Topic started by: Cynaburst on April 11, 2010, 10:57:20 pm
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1. http://articles.latimes.com/2010/apr/06/local/la-me-cedars-sinai6-2010apr06 -- He sued Cedars-Sinai for wrongful termination and got a multimillion dollar arbitration award against them.
2. http://articles.latimes.com/2010/apr/09/local/la-me-malpractice9-2010apr09 -- He was sued by a patient for malpractice and got an $800K judgment against him for failing to remove the man's tumor.
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Very interesting articles.
Thanks for posting them.
Jan
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Cynaburst,
Thanks for pointing out these articles on a controversial surgeon.
Regards,
Rob
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YIKES!
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Is this the same doctor who operates out of the Skull Base Institute? If not, they have the same name. The article didn't mention SBI, which makes me wonder if this is the same doctor.
Thanks,
TW
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Is this the same doctor who operates out of the Skull Base Institute? If not, they have the same name.
I believe it is the same doctor.
Jan
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I'm still torn on the whole Shahinian debate. I actually had an appointment for surgery with him, but decided to keep watching and waiting (my trigeminal neuralgia subsided). I, too, was warned against him--the rest of the neuro community absolutely hates him. But............the big but...............the few people on this forum who used him sing his praises. If I ever have to have surgery I'll have to go through the same excrutiating selection process all over again. Oy. Stay under 2, little guy.
Sharon
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YIKES! is right!
I would not ever recommend anyone have brain surgery performed by a general surgeon! Maybe an appendectomy, but brain surgery? I had no idea he was not a neurosurgeon. That is just a scary thought.
I'm sure there are those that are happy with him and pleased with their outcome, but I'd venture to say (and I know I will make those aforementioned folks angry), they're lucky!
Thanks for sharing this info. People should know these things before they make their final decision on a treatment.
Lori
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Just to give a little balance, Dr. Shahinian trained in reconstructive facial surgery, an activity that involves removing tumors from various parts of the jaw, face, and head. He is by no means a "nip and tuck" plastic surgeon. He has published a number of articles on surgical removal of various difficult tumors from the face and head, particularly using endoscopic techniques, and is quite accomplished in the field.
His maverick status stems from his decision to apply these techniques to skull base surgery. It can be argued that when done with an endoscope, it does not require a neurosurgeon. However it is certainly the case that most of the skull base medical community does not approve of what he does. He has continued it anyway, because people come from all over the world to see him.
I don't honestly know if I would go to him, but I don't think it is fair to call him a quack, either.
Steve
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Thanks Steve for your input on this thread. I was trying to come up with how to say the same thing you did. I did quite a bit of research on Dr. Shanian and while I thought the articles were interesting it didn't change my mind about him as a surgeon. I don't think it is fair to judge unless you have all the information. I was told at my last appt. at MEI by Dr. Kartush that they are starting to do endescopic surgery for AN's, although he does not recommend it in my case because of the size of the tumor. If my insurance would pay for SBI I truly believe I would do it in a heartbeat.
Sue in Michigan
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Unfortunately many people in the medical profession dont like new techniques due to the countless hungry lawyers out there. People in that field tend to have cliques that they are loyal to. Unfortunately surgery has too many variables to treat it like a Consumer Reports review. BTW CR has made some horrible recommendations in the past and I never listen to them about anything.
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To each his own, but there is a BIG difference between removing a tumor from one's face/jaw and removing one in someone's brain. I have no problem with doctors pioneering new and different techniques, but I am not comfortable with them doing it in a field they are not trained in. I would no sooner feel comfortable with a maxillofacial surgeon removing a brain tumor, and he's probably got more intimate knowledge of that part of the body than a general surgeon.
I guess I just have an issue with a doctor who is removing an ingrown toenail one minute and drilling through someone's skull the next. If he wants to specialize in skull base tumors, he should have the formal education to do so.
Pete, CR helped me pick out a good vacuum cleaner! ;)
Lori
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While I'm past the point of needing to hire a neurosurgeon to remove my AN, I have to admit that the controversial Dr. Shahinian and his endoscopic technique for removing acoustic neuromas has always interested me. Back in 2006, as I was preparing for my AN debulking surgery, I mentioned this technique to my neurosurgeon and asked him if it was viable. He said that he had never heard of using the endoscopic procedure on ANs - and he thought it was very risky. At that point I dismissed any idea of going that route and assumed endoscopic surgery to remove ANs was 'experimental' and not feasible in my case. Fortunately, my debulking procedure went well and I've never regretted choosing that route.
Even so, I can see why many AN patients are excited about this minimally invasive form of AN surgery. Were I diagnosed today, I would thoroughly investigate it. However,being the practical type, I would probably chose traditional AN surgery. After reading the New York Times articles, I would definitely pass on Dr. Shahinian and his endoscopic procedure but I wouldn't reject him as a possible choice for other AN patients facing surgery. I would, however, advise such AN patients to vet this physician thoroughly and understand that every surgical procedure carries risks, which is why they have you sign the waiver before the surgery, acknowledging that you've been informed of the (often grim) possibilities that could occur as a result of the surgery.
Frankly, these articles are not encouraging and I believe it will take some years and much demonstrable success of endoscopic AN surgery before it - and Dr. Shahinian - are accepted and trusted by the doctor's peers and the medical profession, in general.
Jim
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Somehow my post in this thread dissapeared. Here it is one more time.
Of all doctors, neurosurgeons have the highest malpractice insurance premiums because just about everybody gets sued. The most experienced and skilled surgeons sometimes have the worst outcomes. A patient can only pray and hope to be on the right side of this doctor's statistics because any brain surgery that does not work out is absolutely devastating. I wonder how many other neurosurgeons make mistakes, and how come their malpractice suits and payouts are not in the news? It would certainly be interesting to compare. I don't think it is fair to name Dr. Sh "a quack" based on this one-sided presentation of events.
Meanwhile, I am happy that my surgery with him worked out and I do think it is because of his skill. I am neither pro- nor against any particular doctor but rather advocate for making an educated decision about your own treatment. I am also very happy when anybody else's surgery( or radiation) with any other neurosurgeon works out. It just makes my day.
Eve
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I am not a neurosurgeon. But I did stay at a Holiday Inn. ;D
TW
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I had AN surgery with Dr. Shahinian last December. My stay in the hospital was only 2 days. I just had my post-op MRI with my ENT at the Medical Center in Houston and everything was "perfect" according to the doctor, who is also a surgeon who works on ANs. I have no facial problems, no headache problems, and just a few balance problems.
The "what to do" decision on my AN was the hardest and scariest decision of my life. While trying to make that decision I spoke with several medical professionals. One of the points that was brought up was that when surgeons in Houston were first doing open heart surgery and transplants many doctors thought those doctors and procedures were dangerous and crazy. Now those procedures are commonplace. I am sure mistakes are made by all surgeons sometime during their career. They are not Gods. Like stated in a prior message, brain surgeons have the highest malpractice rates. I bet cardiac surgeons are next.
I believe that any new procedures that are not know by the majority of the doctors in a field will always be questioned. It is my understanding that endoscopic surgery for brain tumors (including ANs) is now being taught at PMC, so it seems to me that it is starting to be accepted by some of the medical community. I can only finish by saying that I was very happy with my surgery at Thousand Oaks Hospital with Dr. Shahinian and I am offended by the "lucky" comment.
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I'm certainly not questioning the use of endoscopic surgery - I think it's a great option and in the future, hopefully, they'll be able to do most surgeries that way - it's much less invasive. And they certainly already remove much larger body parts that way with great results. My concern is this procedure being done by someone who may not have the qualifications to do so. He clearly knows what he's doing, but just knowing how to do it and having the formal training and/or licensing to do it are very different issues. I feel if he wants to perform this type of surgery, he should go about the formalities. That's just my opinion. I'm very much "by the book" when it comes to some things. I'm sure some will see it as just more hoops one must jump through, but those hoops are there for a reason. There has to be some oversight and consistency.
Eve, I certainly didn't mean to imply he is a quack. Not at all. Like I said, he clearly knows what he's doing, or he wouldn't have had any good results! And I'm truly happy that you and the others here who have used him have had such great results. And Marsha, I apologize if I've offended you. I certainly did not mean to.
All doctors get sued and all malpractice insurance is expensive. Yes, neurosurgeons probably pay the most because the possibilities of a bad outcome are so high. It's much more risky than having a tooth pulled. I would think that by performing a surgery that is not technically within your area of certification would just open you up to being sued. I'd be willing to bet there are patients of his that don't know he's not a neurosurgeon, or don't know the difference between a general surgeon and a neurosurgeon. So, something doesn't go as planned, they get mad, go find one of those lawyers on tv who will sue anything that moves and they'll emphasize to the court that this doctor performed a surgery that maybe he shouldn't be allowed to. Those lawyers make sure it gets publicized because that brings them more business. Unfortunately that's just the reality of the society we live in.
But, like was mentioned before, patients have to do their own research and decide what their best option is. I would not suggest that anyone made a poor choice because he did not do what I did. I would hope that after all is said and done, everyone is happy with his choice.
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I am not offended by the lucky comment at all and patients of Dr. Shahinian shouldn't be either. We are all in a sense lucky - whether we had surgery with this doctor or not.
Although I didn't have an endoscopic procedure, I am extremely lucky and I tell my doc that every time I see him. AN surgery - whether conventional or endoscopic - is a crap shoot. No one can guarantee you a stellar outcome. As Marsha said, surgeons aren't God (although some do think they are ;) )
My surgery could be considered "perfect" also - I don't suffer from facial paralysis, headaches, or balance issues either. Yes, I'm SSD, but that's a very minor point in the scope of things.
Although I used to believe that endoscopic surgery might be the wave of the future, more and more these days I'm inclined to believe that that distinction will go to radiation treatment of ANs.
As for Dr. Shahinian, I won't go as far as to call him a quack but I don't think the news about him is great. He may have performed surgery on patients who had wonderful outcomes, but I think the articles in the LA Times speak for themselves and should be taken seriously by anyone considering surgery with him.
Jan
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Marsha, do you have any usable hearing in your AN ear post surgery?
Eve
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Dr. Shahinian, while he may have had SOME successful outcomes, is a general surgeon, NOT a neurosurgeon. Even a broken clock is right twice a day. I would never recommend having a general surgeon perform brain surgery, especially a technique that is still very new. Think about it, you go in for a laparoscopic cholecystectomy (gall bladder) surgery and a complication causes the surgeon to have t switch to an open procedure. This is all fine and dandy if the surgeon is trained in the procedure, but this doctor is NOT a trained neurosurgeon so what happens if the endoscopic approach fails or he runs into a complication that's over his head? Do your research, malpractice information is available on line for all physicians and I would hope everyone would read every scrap of info on any physician they are considering for this surgery.
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Wow, can't believe that we are still debating Dr. Shaninian.
Glad to see we are though :) Very controversial doc.
Jan